Frontpage EOL and Termination of Support

[mtatem]

I have alot of customers that rely on FP extensions for processing their forms and also for editing their websites. All of these clients are on Windows boxes and would rather not see the extensions go as it will cause a lot of fustration among my clients that actively use it on their small websites. What options will Vortech be supplying for sites that use the server extensions to process forms? This is the biggest concern I have as I need a forms processor that works on .htm amd .html pages. Do not want to have to convert to different languages on those clients websites as the whole website will need to be relinked in order to process their 1 contact page.

Regular FTP is fine by me but the extensions did serve for alot of functionality for MS FP based website with reporting features, forms processors, site maps, automatic xml filelists for the search engines, good listing and placement on search engines, etc.

[dpyers]

No need to relink the whole site, just specify a different form handler in the .htm or .html page. Plenty of asp, php, and .net examples to choose from.
Many sites will auto-generate form handlers for you similar to the site referenced in Tina's link for EW tutortials.

[torobravo]

Sure, Vortech has the right to do whatever they want with their terms of service and the features they offer on their hosting plans. However, one could think that taking such a decision that is likely to put in trouble a number of clients (as proven if needed by the many comments of angry customers on this thread), demonstrates a genuine lack of concern about their client's needs. Anyway, what can you expect from someone that announces the termination of FP server extensions but still displays them as an available feature on its selling site vortechhosting.com in order to catch new clients ?
Real bad behaviour and that's all.

[jbryandavis]

Originally Posted by levseltzer

Do you mean "FTP" in the true sense, or the web publishing feature called "FrontPage Server Extensions" that is part of MSFP and MS Expression Web? I make use of this feature every day - I find I can publish much faster using this, rather than using standard FTP. While I have already migrated away from most features that require FP Server extensions, I would not like to lose this particular feature.

The quickest way to get away from these problems is use another program. May I suggest Dreamweaver?! --- I use it for development and I'll say 1-click uploading makes the loss I take of buying the product well worth it. I can develop PHP with color-coding as well as many other features that I've bought (some I use, others I don't) and its' well worth the investment in the project, and if something happens it doesn't matter. I recently switched from Windows to Linux, best thing I've ever done.
Hope that helps...
Joe

[torobravo]

I understand that FP extensions are not very reliable in many aspects and this is certainly the reason why Microsoft decided to get rid of them in the future. This is also an issue for a hosting company like Vortech which probably has to dedicate too much support time for this single feature. However, Vortech's decision shows little concern about their previous comitments and they should at least have left the door open for their long-run customers who are not prepared to make the change right now. Why not, for example, leave this feature available with a supplement on the price?

[jbryandavis]

Originally Posted by torobravo

I understand that FP extensions are not very reliable in many aspects and this is certainly the reason why Microsoft decided to get rid of them in the future. This is also an issue for a hosting company like Vortech which probably has to dedicate too much support time for this single feature. However, Vortech's decision shows little concern about their previous comitments and they should at least have left the door open for their long-run customers who are not prepared to make the change right now. Why not, for example, leave this feature available with a supplement on the price?

Well, I couldn't begin to tell them what to do. If it was me, I'd keep it enabled but absolutely refuse to support the product. Meaning, you like it so much figure out the problems on your own... submit a ticket, and it'll go unanswered but that's me.

[Steve]

Originally Posted by jbryandavis

Well, I couldn't begin to tell them what to do. If it was me, I'd keep it enabled but absolutely refuse to support the product. Meaning, you like it so much figure out the problems on your own... submit a ticket, and it'll go unanswered but that's me.

Hmmm, have support that does not support. clever.

The facts of the matter is this. Microsoft is going to support FPSE in windows until 2011. The reason that vortech is stopping support is faulty in this light. Vortech has sold many resellers on the fact that they support FP.

Why aren't more people upset that we, the resellers, are the bad guys here with our clients and it is us, the resellers that will lose business over this. We will still have to pay the same to vortech, but we lose money.

It is next to impossible to move clients off of the vortech servers and on to another companies, so we need to get together on this and realize that vortech is the only known company that is stopping support of FPSE. The ONLY one.

I average over 90% of clients on windows vs. Unix. I have looked in the control panels and all that I have checked have FPSE enabled. From glancing at their web sites, I would say that over 80% are using FP in some fashion.

attention resellers. if this is the trend and it seems to be, you had better do some research yourselves and get alarmed over this. you will lose business if FPSE are removed.

[cleonard]

Hey Steve,

I hear your frustration, but Vortech is not the "ONLY" company who is no longer going to have FPSE available. Directi, for instance, sent me and email not too long ago that September 26th they would remove them. Not bad, they gave me a whole 7 days notice.

[cdwise]

As Ron and Tina have both stated FrontPage Server Extensions for Windows 2003 will continue to be supported by Microsoft. There are also beta extensions for Vista and Server 2008. See http://blogs.msdn.com/robert_mcmurra...and-vista.aspx

Personally I don't use the FPSE but I have half a dozen clients who use them. All but one of which are on these servers. I expect they will be transferring to other hosting that continues to support FPSE. I know there are plenty out there who have no plans to discontinue FPSE support. I spoke with several at the recent Webmaster Jam Session conference in Dallas that have no plans to discontinue FPSE support as long as MS plans to continue to support them and/or develop them for future servers.

Cheryl D Wise
MS MVP Expression
http://by-expression.com

[dpyers]

I'd ditto Cleonard's remarks. Of the two other companies I have accounts with, One dropped support July 1st, and the other on September 1st.

[awen]

Steve, I have yet to try and leave Vortech, but I seriously doubt they are "next to impossible" to move off from. I'm sure they would be quite happy to show the door to most of us that post here and complain. Justified or not. Vortech has never had a reputation that I have heard of to hold domains or data hostage, unlike very many other hosts. To say that is very unfair unless you have something back it up.

As I have said in another recent post, I'm not thrilled with Vortech Inc these days, but I'm not going to state untrue facts either. Just my opinions.

I share your pain with the support of FP going away, as I have stated... but I also always knew there would come this day, sometime, somewhere... There is much more to Vortech than FrontPage, for example the fact that since I signed up we have been given more resources without price increases. Sooner or later we're going to have to give up something.

We're just going to have to adapt, and those that can't will have to move on, but the horizon of hosts that support FrontPage is dim, and growing dimmer each day.

Attn. Resellers, the only thing that is constant is change... better get used to it.

Steve hints at a boycott or riot, it's not going work. What will be, will be. Whether or not the change comes at the end of this year, or in 2011 is beside the point. Steve thinks Vortech is the only reseller supporting FP, I find this in itself to be flawed thinking, but the day WILL come where somebody is the last host to support it, and they will eventually stop.

We might as well move on now while we can rather than be the last dinosaurs gasping for breath.

Take that how you want it.

[Steve]

Originally Posted by awen

Steve, I have yet to try and leave Vortech, but I seriously doubt they are "next to impossible" to move off from.

<snip>

Steve hints at a boycott or riot, it's not going work. <snip>

Awen,

Please do not put words in my mouth. I did not and would suggest such a thing. Do I think it would be good to be organized and present a unified front to let Vortech know there are more then a few voices in the wilderness, of course. But to put my name in association with anything negative or violent. Well, you have gone to far with that remark and I would like an apology.

To your first point, Moving has nothing to do with Vortech. If you manage many different account, then you know exactly the problems that would come up in moving a client.

1. their site would be down for several days while the DNS records update.
2. they would loose services and email while this takes place.
3. you would need to record every setting that the customer has made to modify their control panel
4. you would have to request all passwords for
a. email accounts
b. databases
5. you would have to create new DNS records on the new server so both systems can be active at the same time
6. you would have to publish each site, recreate all email addresses, all databases on the new server.
and after all that you would still have to get them to update their IP addresses to the new DNS servers.

I am sure there is more that I am not thinking of right now.

If that sounds easy to you, when multiplied by all of your customers, ....

The only real choice we have is to start a new relationship with another company that supports FP and then say to our customers. "We are taking away FPSE's from your account but if you want them still you can move to another server yourself" and pray that we can keep their business.

Final word on this is that we are not going to change Vortech's mind on this so we need to get on with it and make arrangements to help our customers as best we can.

[romanz]

Hello Vertech,

Please reconsider to continue FP extensions support. I've several clients who use FP extensions for feedback form as well as database handling. Some of my clients would go away and find FP extensions support rather than redo their database.

Regards,
Roman

[Tina]

they won't...... get your clients to swap to php or asp forms there are free ones....

what i would like to know is .. when the fpse are turned off wholesale.. so we have to do anything on those sites or plans that have fpse turned on (I use fpse for publishing ONLY) ... or what? .... do we have to change the plan ourselves or will it automatically turn off the fpse and change the plans that have it on to ftp or the sites that have it on on the plans that have it to ftp?

tell us what happens on that score no one has mentioned it and i have a bunch of plans with it turned one .. I don't resell .. ..its all my own sites ..... but I'd like to know .. particulary as I am using ew and its a pita cos the ftp does not remember the logins ... but at least I can still open the site live in ew with ftp which is why i liked publishing with fp/ew with fpse ... though of course there are less options for implemention...

Tina

[mresell]

I do have to say that 4mnths isn't enough notice. I don't care for FP much, but bein MS product it is popular. However, it makes one wary about the services/policies u offer and how that reflects on us. With all the logistics involved going down the hierarchy of multiple users etc... More time at the very least should be given. Any major feature that has been used widely for such a long time shouldn't be yanked like that. If support is an issue my problem with that is most of the support for resellers should be on them and if it is your retail customers that is in conflict w/ your reseller needs. Hosting business is tough enough w/o this kinda short notice changes.