01/16/2004 Mssql2

[admin]

Sorry it took so long guys.. I had no idea the drive was taken a crap.. Once I got MS on the phone they were able to look a little deeper and said it would be best to restore all the working DB's that we had, and pull from backups for the reset.

We try very hard to keep backups up to date and working so you don't lose every thing. This time did prove they are working just as they should..

Again I am very sorry about the downtime and was moving as fast as we could and also be safe with the data.

We also don't have replication servers and have no plans for that within this cluster.. That would add a LOT of cost to do that having to have 5 more servers just for the mssql systems we have online.. Thats 10U of space plus bandwidth and mangment time of the servers. I just think that might be pushing it for this price rang.. Maybe once we get the highend cluster off the ground we could do that..

[admin]

Also if you are still having an issue please put in a ticket but EVERY single database was restored but one and I think it was a new database as it did not even have time to get in to the backups..

[Maayan]

Hi Vortech Guys,

I'm sorry for being rude earlier.

It was 3 AM here, I got up every 30 mins to check thing up and when I saw that data might get lost I reacted the way I shouldn't. I applogize for that.

Altogether I'm *VERY* satistfied from Vortech level of service, and I'm using web hosting since 1997. You have the best I've ever seen.

Thanks for your efforts!

- Maayan

[Brangwyn]

Just as an aside, for replication you probably wouldn't need 5 more servers, you may be able to get away with 1 possibly two depending on the architecture you go with. I guess it could then be offered as an extra for $x.xx per month.

Of course as always integrating it with H-Sphere would be the pain, and the time needed to do it might not outway the additional revenue you may gain by offering it as a value-add service to customers.

[newmem]

Originally Posted by Brangwyn

Vortech have always been pretty consistent on backup polcies as well, its up to the individual account holder to ensure they have satisfactory backups to recover their data if required.

I am sure Vortech will always try it's best to make sure no data is lost. However, let's take a worst-case scenerio. Suppose we were to lose all the db's on the sql server and the backups were also either lost or not created properly, and after doing all the hard work of reinstalling etc. if even 1 client loses his entire data or a part of the data due to which he would lose his entire business built by months or years of hard work and stored in the db, then that would be a major loss.

So what I am suggesting to Vortech is giving the end user the ability to:

a) take a backup of his db manually by running an ASP script (he may also decide set a cron job to run it everyday or every month depending on how much valuable is the db to him)
b) run another script to transfer the backup file to his ftp folder since there is no ftp access to the sql servers where the backup files are stored.

Then it would be his responsibility to download the backup to his own computer in case all data was to be lost on Vortech servers and could not be restored automatically by Admin. That way, even though Vortech is doing it's best even when situations are not in it's control, the end user has both the responsibility and MEANS to save his db (i.e. his entire business) instead of only responsibility.

Why I suggest running a script and moving the file to ftp is bcos

a) not everyone can install an SQL server and EM on his PC and learn how to use it
b) people like me who has installed EM but cannot use it to connect to the db due to ISP firewalls
c) people who can use EM but their dial-up speed and connection cannot wait for the long time that EM takes to actually show the db.

There is no question of costs here, since a programmer can easily cook up these 2 scripts in 1-2 hours. So even those resellers who *only* pay $35 will have a chance to save their or their client's businesses in case of tragedy occurs. No one deserves to lose his life's collected data, no matter whether they pay $35 pm or $250 pm..........and I am sure to Vortech Admin the end user's benefit is always at heart and that is why I am suggesting this method. Please consider it......

Thanks.

[Brasil]

Hello guys,

Could you please give priority to my ticket [CRV-22503]?

It´s regarding this issue here and it´s still not resolved...almost 21 hours...

My client is starting to write messages all finishing with five exclamation marks!!!!!...so you can imagine...

PLease, reply my ticket.

Thanks very much

[admin]

Brasil, I answered yours ticket and email. But it looks like john and some others had already been working with you and got it fixed.

Thanks

[Brangwyn]

One of my customers reported their mssql2 based site going down again for a while, was there another problem with it in the last few hours ?

[soky]

Well folks... I was in Key West yesterday when this all happened... I lost two confirmed orders and probably several more during the outage... am I complaining? NO! This is the greatest support I have EVER SEEN. "Stuff" happens but instead of sweeping it under the rug, you folks shared the process with us so we could reply intelligently to our clients... in my book that's worth ALLOT!

Yes, I am glad it's back up... no I'm not glad it happened but frankly.... I feel if I had to endure this... it's best to endure with a vendor who provides regular updates and information.

THANK YOU.

It's because of your superior service I can go to Coronado Island, CA., Bourbon Street, LA and Key West, FL and still know my servers and customers are well taken care of!!! (Thanks for the good week off)

[admin]

Originally Posted by soky

Well folks... I was in Key West yesterday when this all happened... I lost two confirmed orders and probably several more during the outage... am I complaining? NO! This is the greatest support I have EVER SEEN. "Stuff" happens but instead of sweeping it under the rug, you folks shared the process with us so we could reply intelligently to our clients... in my book that's worth ALLOT!

Yes, I am glad it's back up... no I'm not glad it happened but frankly.... I feel if I had to endure this... it's best to endure with a vendor who provides regular updates and information.

THANK YOU.

It's because of your superior service I can go to Coronado Island, CA., Bourbon Street, LA and Key West, FL and still know my servers and customers are well taken care of!!! (Thanks for the good week off)

We try very hard soky.. Thanks..

[newmem]

any thoughts on my suggestions?

[antic]

I'm also interested in newmem's suggestion of allowing backups via script.

1. Is it possible to allow use of the SQL command BACKUP for this purpose?

2. Quite some time ago, I also suggested a way of allowing access to backups, using a procedure which is perfectly secure and easy to implement for all parties - Vortech, resellers and clients. I didn't get a response from it, which makes me think newmem's suggestion will also be left unaddressed.
My original suggestion: http://www.matrixreseller.com/forum/...3445#post53445

I can only hope that one of these suggestions is considered, as newmem is quite right that clients can't be expected to learn how to make SQL backups themselves, simple as that.

Also, many thanks to Vortech for their excellent sense of transparency and openness about the inevitable problems that arise in this business. This will always win you points in my book! However, if there are suggestions being made to improve things, however wacky they may seem (ie. mine) please consider them! :P

[Brangwyn]

Personally speaking, I don't think people who can't make SQL Backups themselves should really be using SQL Server in the first place, I've had many customers ask for SQL Just becuase they can, not becuase they needed too.

Obviously I'm not specifically saying newmem or anyone else here for that matter shouldn't be using SQL, he's got a bit of a different issue really with his ISP blocking 1433 when theres really no good reason to do so (the slammer isn't really an excuse for this becuase it propagated over 1434 as I recall). I do think though as a "responsible" host, its up to us to educate our customers about some of these things so they make informed decisions about what suits them best, even if that means telling them to go elsewhere, anything mission critical shouldn't be sitting on a shared hosting environment imo.

Perhaps the easiest solution all round might actually be for Vortech to review the policy on Database backups and perhaps commit to say being able to provide them at an additional cost *guaranteed* x days of recoverable data.

[newmem]

If my suggestion works, then there's no need of incurring any additional costs. We can just provide the scripts in the download section to all. Those who are serious about it will use the script.

Those who don't want to do that can rely on the automatic backups taken by the system, which has proved to be quite reliable till now, but what we are looking for is some way to make the end user also responsible and capable of taking care of their own db's.

"Personally speaking, I don't think people who can't make SQL Backups themselves should really be using SQL Server in the first place"

I don't think that's entirely true. If your programmer suggests that you should use the SQL db instead of Access depending on your requirements, then you can't argue that you do not know how to take a backup and so you should use Access which is easy to backup just by downloading via ftp. If SQL is needed, then it has to be used.

I have all the knowledge of using EM but I wouldn't expect any of my clients to install SQL server on their PC and learn how to use EM. It would be a lot simpler just to set up a cron job for them to take the backups automatically. And in case something bad happens, I don't have to face a law suit for not taking care of their db - it's their responsibility to take the backup and I have provided the tools for it.

[Brangwyn]

If your site is being written by an independant programmer rather than yourself and they recommend using MS SQL the they should also be providing you with adeqaute training in how to use the product assuming they don't provide the support themselves, no excuses for a programmer to dump a technology on a customer and expect them to know what to do to me that would seem unprofessional.