Should I Stay . . . or Should I Go

[Craig_Smith]

cleonard,

If you want my 2 sense worth from a non-techie point of view,, if you don't use ASP, ASP.Net or Cold Fusion there is not one legitimate reason I can think of to use windows for Hosting. I have yet to see something done in ASP that isn't done in PHP 1000X better, stronger and faster and with half the problems you get with windows.

You also asked "is it that closely integrated"..
Well yes, this is the problem. H-Sphere is basically a GUI that sits on top of Windows,, and everyone know Windows and all things MS don't get along well with others.

I personally am staying as long as vortech wants me around, :P. Their service has been great, they are open about problems, sure some thing happen that don't seem to be a problem at the time (some of the email issues that were part of "upcoming" DNS issues) but sometimes bug have to be found in a live enviroment before they can be fixed. I personally only use the windows side to "play" on, I use the unix for anything that need to stay up more often, and get the job done; and I would use this same idea on any host. Also, if you think about it for a minute, it is easier to design a Control Panel FOR unix that works more reliabely because everything can be done via CLI, no GUI requiresd, so the web-frontend can be easily programmed without as many "APIs" to control functions, this can certainly not be said for windows, while some things can be controled via CLI, many items can not be access without the windows GUI which need additional APIs to access the same functions.

[somereseller]

The real problems seems to come from PSoft. Not being able to login to the CP or to your FTP site is a major situation which we did not encounter often (or at least not for long periods of time).

The linux side has been quite stable, if you call, not being able to send emails from you scripts a minor problem per example. It's not really big server problems and I would still consider this downtime, but it's probably just me... The problem with theses is that it can take a long time to fix and you have nothing more to tell your customers than to wait. Wait on PSoft that is...

I personally think that Hsphere is not ready for reselling. I've been waiting for 8 month and it's not my primary business so it's not a big loss, it's a great tool to configure your own set of websites, but it's too risky to offer support on this platform. I've got so many billing errors in my statements that I always end up disabling the billing system for my customers when I can.

I had less problems with CPanel, it was veeeery sloooow, offered less functionalities, was often broken because of the nightly builds, but most of the time the fixes were quickly applied.




admin, look at post 2933. "You will be able to very soon. We are working a deal with the co. that makes them." That's why I was disappointed by your offer about the demodemo sets, there was nothing that we couldn't get before since their website was advertised on Psoft's own website long before your posts

[Craig_Smith]

Sounds like you have your own issues,, but let me say we have alot more people to bill than you do and it works fine using the H-Sphere billing along with Authorize.net.

back to cleonard's topic,,,

The bottom line is there are certainly problems with H-sphere and there will ALWAYS be problems with Windows. The way I look at it is, If i were you, would I rather go to a smaller company where they don't have the staff or recources to add lots of servers every month and offer the support we offer. Or,, a larger outfit who treats everyone like a number and charges twice as much for less and keep 0 communication with their customers.
And lets face it,, any problems we face with H-Sphere every other host will too eventually, the difference is we have closer relationship with Psoft than anyone else and the staff and resources to solve the problems faster than anyone.

What took us 2 weeks to fix could have easily taken a lesser company 2 months or worse and then put them in the red so bad they never recovered.

[somereseller]

LOL, billing works fine....I've reported some errors and some other users too, just look at the recent PSoft patches...I fear every major update because some past one brought many troubles. That billing system could be ok if we could edit the statements. Many problems probably come from the fact that I'm not using the default currency...

But I agree with you on the Hsphere/Vortech combo.
If a user wants Hsphere then Vortech is the way to go.
I just think Hsphere is not for every one.
IBM Sphera is a very nice alternative (very customizable by resellers, VDS). Maybe Vortech should take a look at it?

[matthewshull]

Not meaning to bad mouth, but...

One thing I can add is that Matrix does seem to have a "major" problem that "we'll get through it" always seems to be the answer. I signed up in July, and there have always been customers "scared" to put real clients on these servers. There are good things about Matrix, such as these forums, and relatively good support. But I think there are way too many problems on the servers that just make em unreliable for any important client.

Also, the reliance on PSoft sometimes makes me wonder what you guys actually do? Sometimes it seems a little much. If PSoft went out of business, would you guys follow?

Take care.

[Craig_Smith]

CLARIFY,, too many problems on the Windows servers.
I'm going to correct everyone from now on on this, because our unix stuf has had excellent uptime. I have personal sites that are extremely important to me hosted here using H-Sphere on unix and they have experienced hardly any downtime at all since July. My mail has never NOT worked and all my php and MY SQL stuff has never had one single problem..EVER. on UNIX.


As for H-Sphere,, we rely on Psoft for code fixes, after all it is their software but we were a thriving company before we used h-Sphere and would do fine without it. Only about half of out total servers are using or have anything to do with H-SPhere.
Only about a third of our total client base uses it as well.

[vonbrocklin]

Just a note about W2K hosting:

I am actually slowly moving everything I do over to PHP for a variety of reasons. However, for YEARS I have built everything in ASP and SQL server on the Windows side. I put my most important clients at MaximumAsp.Com and I have not had more than a couple minutes of downtime in well over a year. Of course they pay good money for it, but my point is that W2K can be a very reliable hosting platform in the right hands. Not to say that Matrix does not know what they are doing (they do) but that W2K does not always deserve the rep it gets for being unreliable.

[Craig_Smith]

$159.00 per MONTH! for their lowest plan...and its a "virtual private server". I would hope for that much money you would not have ANY downtime since the are not giving near the features we are.

I am no Win2k expert but with that type of setup I would think it would work good since its sort of like a dedicated server which IMO is the only way i would use windows,,, no CP, just the server by myself. But man thats STEEP! for $100 more you could have your own dedicated server just about anywhere.

Its not that I don't like windows,, believe me for home its alot of fun,, I couldn't live without it. But when you want to share with others or add any type of thrid party non-MS app,, forget it.

[vonbrocklin]

I didn't say it was cheap! But it is damn reliable, which was my point. They host time.com and a number of other high profile sites. All I'm saying is that W2K by itself is not necessarily an unreliable platform. Add in HSphere or other junk and it is a whole different story.

And to get this thread back on track for the original poster:

Search on my name and you will see that I went through the exact same doubts. I STILL have doubts and STILL have not moved over my most important and demanding clients. But when all is said and done, I am STILL here and by and large quite happy. For the price and the amount of support you get, it will be hard to go wrong here. PSoft/HSphere can be a major headache but Matrix flat out cares, even if things do not always go as planned.

[somereseller]

Originally posted by Craig_Smith
My mail has never NOT worked and all my php and MY SQL stuff has never had one single problem..EVER. on UNIX.

Where are your sites hosted? It sure isn't on unix.hsphere.cc. There have been numerous issues on that server since July. Mail sending from scripts was not working for close two 2 months...We went through all the other PHP problems already (and I'm not saying that it's your fault).
It's not allways about uptime. Things have to work the way they're supposed to too.

[somereseller]

Originally posted by matthewshull
Not meaning to bad mouth, but...

One thing I can add is that Matrix does seem to have a "major" problem that "we'll get through it" always seems to be the answer. I signed up in July, and there have always been customers "scared" to put real clients on these servers. There are good things about Matrix, such as these forums, and relatively good support. But I think there are way too many problems on the servers that just make em unreliable for any important client.

Also, the reliance on PSoft sometimes makes me wonder what you guys actually do? Sometimes it seems a little much. If PSoft went out of business, would you guys follow?

Take care.

I agree with most of what you've said except for the last part. When we have severe issues, I get the same feeling, all we have to do is wait on Psoft, but when we need some new perl/PHP modules, the unix team is present and willing to improve their hosting environnement. You just have to be patient sometimes .

[Craig_Smith]

Scripts,, what scripts are you talking about?,, I use mail I use Eudora I use Outlook I use Webmail,, it ALL has worked since I set it up. I think some of my stuff is on unix and unix3 and a newer one on unix5 I think.

I also use OsCommerce (I wrote the tutorial) PHPbb,,, PHP Nuke, and some other custom PHP stuff for my own testing and THEY ALL WORK GREAT.
Now i may not be as advanced as you with PHP (actually i'm sure I'm not), but i've never had a problem. Thats all i'm saying.
I swear you guys pick apart every little thing.

also,, what do you think the Vortech and Matirx stuff is hosted on? FreeBSD!,, How many times have you seen our sites down or this board down?

[somereseller]

Any script that was sending emails to a domain hosted at Matrix could suddenly hang. It happened at random, many time during the day.
It was a new feature of 2.2. Has disappeared with 2.3. Anyway This meant that every form such as a "contact us" form could make a customer's browser hang. Maybe I was the only one affected...still, close to two months to wait for a solution stopped me from building major sites on Hsphere hosting. I'm scared like it was mentionned before. I have responsabilities towards my customers and I cannot tell them :"Oh well it's Psoft whos screwed again, your site is hosted with beta software so deal with it". My customers don't care about the details, they bought a solution from me and everything better work

I can't wait for Hsphere to stabilize and improve (more flexibility), it's the best thing next to a dedicated server for managing your customers website.

Keep the faith and find a way to open Psoft's ears (their communication channels with end users is somewhat closed)

[dwhite]

Originally posted by somereseller
Any script that was sending emails to a domain hosted at Matrix could suddenly hang. It happened at random, many time during the day.
It was a new feature of 2.2. Has disappeared with 2.3. Anyway This meant that every form such as a "contact us" form could make a customer's browser hang. Maybe I was the only one affected...still, close to two months to wait for a solution stopped me from building major sites on Hsphere hosting. I'm scared like it was mentionned before. I have responsabilities towards my customers and I cannot tell them :"Oh well it's Psoft whos screwed again, your site is hosted with beta software so deal with it". My customers don't care about the details, they bought a solution from me and everything better work

I can't wait for Hsphere to stabilize and improve (more flexibility), it's the best thing next to a dedicated server for managing your customers website.

Keep the faith and find a way to open Psoft's ears (their communication channels with end users is somewhat closed)

I'm right there with you man. In fact was thinking the other day that it is rather an odd combo to be running a such a locked down, buggy, proprietary management solution that they can't hack themselves (no code wizard perhaps?) on an stable opensource platform such as FreeBSD. It has promise, yes, but its not realized its potential yet. Its not a total kludge, but sometimes acts like it.

BTW, I'm still running into some email script hangs at times with 2.3. You weren't the only one. I have found some stability switching to a less complex formhandler written in PHP.