What to do when the old host refuses to transfer domain control?

[tkraffty]

Hey - Have a strange problem: I'm trying to help a client switch web hosts and move his site over to me (here). Problem is that his current web host seems to be refusing to allow my client to take control of his own domain name, which he purchased through them along with the hosting services at the time. I've listed all the details ad nauseum below, but the short request here is simply: Is there any way I can force a name-server change on a domain name my client owns, but his current host is refusing to release?

Here's how the process has gone so far:

* My client purchased his domain name from his current host (ReadyHosting) along with the hosting account.
* He decided to switch to my hosting, and asked ReadyHosting to update his domain name's name-server settings, to point to the new hosting account. Simple enough? Hardly.
* ReadyHosting took a few days to tell him he needs to FAX a domain transfer request to Network Solutions, as ReadyHosting will not update their customers domain name-servers if the requested name-servers are not theirs.
* Now, I just assumed my client could use his existing account at GoDaddy instead of Network Solutions to send a domain transfer request to ReadyHosting, so he could take control of his domain name again and we could update the frickin' name-servers... This assumption comes fromt he fact that I've NEVER even heard of a company requiring a customer to use a SPECIFIC domain registrar.
* We contacted ReadyHosting to see what's up with the transfer request they received (twice) from GoDaddy, and they said - gasp - sorry, but they will ONLY process domain transfer requests to Network Solutions...
* AND not only that, but they said they won't do ANYTHING until my client completely cancels his existing account with them first... which will cause a minimum 1-week downtime while the transfer and name-server changes are made through this FAX or 48-hour-wait-per-single-email-exchange routine that ReadyHosting is forcing upon my client -- and we still have no guarantee that they'll even transfer the domain to GoDaddy, as they're ignoring the request so far...

So now my client and I are stuck... The client has his files on my systems all set-up and ready to go, but his domain name is being held hostage by his current host, those ReadyHosting bastards, who would apparently rather put the client through one or two weeks' full outage instead of just letting him update the name-servers and switch hosts without any interuption.

Being as I'm trying to be his new web host, is there anything I can do to force the name-server changes from my end, given that the current host is refusing to make any changes or relinquish control of the domain settings?

Best regards,

TK

[dtay73]

Having had similiar problems let me tell you what I had to do. First of all, you are concerned with who the REGISTRAR. If they used Network Solutions as the registrar when registering the name then you have to request the name transfer to another registrar "godaddy" from Network Solutions.

Now the rub is WHO is listed as the admin on the domain name. If the hosting company listed themselves as the admin then ONLY they can make the request.

With all that said, you are probably looking at some downtime if they are going to push the canceling of the account. I ended up having to call on the phone and tell them I was going to have to file a complaint with ICANN over the domain registration. Amazingly a week later it was all taken care of and I had the password to the domain and could then change the DNS. Unfortunately not all companies like to play by the "rules" and give the customer the information if they leave.

[awen]

Throw the BBB out there as well. What they are doing is illegal, or should be, and at the very least is harrassment.

Also because Network Solutions is involved you may have a lot of problems transferring from them to GoDaddy.

Sometimes the easiest solution is to just get another domain name and switch to that... although that will probably lose customers. It might even be useful to do for the interim. If your customer doesn't get a lot of traffic right now, I would highly recommend that. $9.00 for a new domain, (consider if your customer has "domain.com" to get "domain.net")

I actually did that once and let the original expire and few months later picked it up again at GoDaddy when it was back on the market. A bit risky, but it was a fairly uncommon name and not too important to me.

Definately report to ICANN and the BBB though. Domain transfer requests should occur within 72hrs, from start to finish.

[TonyK]

I had the same problem few times, the one time I did what awen told you let the domain expire but that didn't worked because the host was the Admin of the domain so he renew the domain for me. I got the domain transfered to Godaddy after I called the registrar and ICCAN told them I had a trade mark on the domain and I'm about to take a legal action and that did it.
I even had a host asking me to pay him the renewal fee for 10 years to transfer the domain, this guy had a page in his CUSTOMER SERVICE AGREEMENT that magicly appear after I asked him why isn't in the customer service agreement that I had to pay him all this money to transfer the domain.
Good luck

[generic]

We'll even pay your domain name registration fees when you sign-up a brand new domain for as long as you're a customer!
You heard it right! We’re going to pay your domain name registration fees as long as you’re a customer of ReadyHosting.com. You’re probably saying, “What’s the Catch?”.

Here's the catch:

Just Click Here to sign-up now and become part of the ReadyHosting family!

nice to be part of the family, I left that family a year ago. You may want to try to point the domain to your new site first, then work on a resolution.

Domain Pointer Fees – Each domain pointer is charged a one-time setup fee. If the domain name is already registered, a one-time $25 setup fee will be charged to the account. If the domain name is a brand new registration, a one-time $50 setup fee will be charged to the account. If you would like to have email accounts setup under the domain pointer, a yearly fee of $25 will be charged to the account. Please note that the setup fee and the yearly fee for email services are non-refundable.

[generic]

also saw this:

DNS Transfers – By registering a domain name through Ready Hosting, Inc., the Customer is establishing a relationship with DomainPeople.com and/or Network Solutions, Inc. separate from the Company and this Agreement. Ready Hosting, Inc. is the domain name hosting business. All customer accounts are setup with the understanding that the Customer will transfer authoritative DNS control of the domain hosted with us, i.e., Ready Hosting, Inc. requires the Customer to update the domain name registration of any domain hosted to the appropriate nameservers. Ready Hosting, Inc. does not provide extended access to its network through non-authoritative DNS means for any purpose other than initial account setup. Third-level domains are provided for 30 days after account creation and may not be used as a primary means of access to an assigned web space.

[awen]

Hmmm, I've never been raped by family...

ReadyHosting just sounds like bad business. A perfect partner for Network Solutions.

Companies like those are what drove me to reselling and Vortech....

[tkraffty]

Yup - Well, I've made a bit of progress after pulling an all-nighter here.

The main problem on ReadyHosting's side is that when my client originally bought the domain from them, ReadyHosting entered their own info under the "Technical Contact" portion of the registration.

So, even though my client is already the Registrant and Administrative contact, he has no real authority to update the name-servers to servers outside of ReadyHosting's control (and they don't permit their tech folks to do that for any of their current customers) - But instead he needs to go through the process of actually FAXing a "Wholesale to Retail Transfer Request" to Network Solutions which makes ReadyHosting give up control of the domain, and basically forces my client to subscribe to Network Solutions and pay more money, just to take Technical control of a domain he ALREADY purchased from Network Solutions... Gadzooks...

I don't know about anyone else here, but it's a given to me that some of my client's might need to switch or move off my systems at some point - for any number of reasons which they don't need to justify to me... and I'm all for supporting that in the interests and expectations that they'll appreciate it and perhaps bring more business back to me later.

ReadyHosting apparently would rather make you a prisoner to their hosting - for reasons that become pretty obvious once you actually experience their dismal support, ignorant or non-existant IT staff, and almost no self-control (control panel) for individual management of account, web and mail services.

To mirror another comment above, it's web hosts like ReadyHosting that made me want to get into this business myself and provide the kind of service I'd always wanted to get before... (thanks Vortech!)

[awen]

My first domain went through NETWORK SOLUTIONS, registered by my first host, whom I will not name here to protect the guilty... naming names is so tacky anyway.

I didn't know anything about commercial hosts, and INTERLAND was of little help. I started with windows servers because I thought it might have something to do with the pc I had at home and how I made the pages... oh well.

NETWORK SOLUTIONS had some kind of god-aweful email/fax form system that you had to modify text in just the right places with the right information to make any changes to your whois info, and it would take a couple days to show up and realize you'd made a mistake.

At my second host I registered an additional domain and that ended up at OPENSRS. I had to email my host to get them to put me as the admin and technical contact though before I could do anything. With hosts like that you are truly at their mercy.

For my next host I decided to go after one named after a movie, "STARGATE". I didn't have much joy there between my sites going down several times a day and limited features, though I liked them long enough to get a friend signed up with them. Later when I moved on to another and tried to host him, they would not let him transfer his domain off their hosting until his 1st year had gone by. (He got one of those special deals of getting his domain registered for free.) I actually logged into his account and changed the nameservers over to mine where they stayed about a week before STARGATE caught on and SWITCHED THEM BACK! The main reason he wanted to leave in the first place was because his site was inaccessable for a few months because of some problem with their server.

Now we're here and quite happy. GODADDY handles my domains. VORTECH handles my hosting, and neither one is stomping all over me.

The best thing we can be to our customers are consultants... and help stop them from making the mistakes we went through or heard about. But in your situation tkraffty, we're almost helpless to help our customers short of reporting and exposing the vile extortionists that are out there.

Even when we can warn them in time, some are too bullheaded and eager for that super deal of "unlimited disk space, unlimited bandwidth, free domains for just $9.95 a month (for eternity).

[mresell]

Why would you want to force someone to stay with you? If they owe you money well that's one thing. That whole thing is weird, especially if he is the registrant. ReadyHosting should pay for that. The domain should be renewed til the date. Definitely transfer from network solutions, asap. However, if something is "free" you better be looking for the strings.

[keidsjedo]

Originally Posted by mresell

Why would you want to force someone to stay with you?

Exactly! I'm still struggling to help a client switch from their "patriotic (America) domain registrar" who has locked the domain. I don't get why they force people to stick around. I guess the registrar gets paid for another term, but why would they want a bunch of angry, not to mention litigious, customers? Argh.

tkraffty, they'll eventually come around. But, unfortunately, sometimes it takes threats (legally acceptable ones of course) and a whole lot of our and our client's time.

[mresell]

Originally Posted by keidsjedo

Exactly! I'm still struggling to help a client switch from their "patriotic (America) domain registrar" who has locked the domain.

tkraffty, they'll eventually come around. But, unfortunately, sometimes it takes threats (legally acceptable ones of course) and a whole lot of our and our client's time.

Keidsjedo,
If that is the company that had big flags on their domain solicitations I bet they ARE trouble. The kept sending me stuff tryin to get me to transfer only making it look like they wanted a renewal. Also they know they aren't supposed to use that info for solicitation.

[generic]

Yes, get about 1 client a month who asks me about that letter. Only had one fall for it.

Considering the cost of bulk mail, I can't believe they get enough people to fall for it and can make enough money on a $25 registration to make it worth the effort.

[keidsjedo]

Yes mresell, it's the one with the flags.

If a company does fall for it, it can potentially become much more than $25. In my client's case, they had to renew for another year to prevent it from expiring. They were about to renew a couple other domains as well. Thankfully, I walked into their life about that time.

If we didn't build it to be the strong name that is, I probably would have advised to just let it go. Even with the lawsuits that they (the registrar) have been through, they've got to be turning quite a profit to continue their practices.

[craigdunlop]

Hmmm, Network Solutions, seems to be mentioned a little in this thread - have had bad issues with them also, Good Luck with it. Must just be sour grapes as I can't see the few dollars made on a domain worth a company's time and reputation to trap them... The industry has a lot of crooks. Within my current domain reseller account, once the domain is transferred to me I seem to be able to just delete all the attached names (billing, tech, admin) and replace them with the ones I want.

So as a domain reseller what is the right way to set up peoples' domains, should they be set up with the clients' contact details for registrar, billing, tech, admin?